Sydenham Mural Planning [2018]



Many thanks for the feedback Nick.

On the first point, I have no qualms about your professional and sound judgement with concerns re: quality of the wall etc. and this is the first time this has been brought up - the Network Rail guy when walking around the site/s mentioned that it was in decent condition and a lot better than the location of some of the other walls they have worked on murals with, particularly citing FH’s impending piece. I can only go off what people who know about these things put forward and taking these things into account may move the mural or change the spec to some degree as written at the bottom of the brief. It would very much appear the artist’s opinion and design combined with the general public’s voting/donations are the two most important things for the project. The only other large wall which fits in with some of the spec which by eye is an easier (and maybe better quality?) surface is the run off from the bridge (opposite the pavilion/next to acorn), however there are issues with that wall that doesn’t fit as well with the mural plan/idea and things around it… (see below!)

In regards to the second point, the idea behind the mural was for it to be a community piece, for the community, voted and funded by locals and therefore when taking into account size, sightlines, location and other (see below) station approach appeared the best NR owned location. The run-off as just mentioned above has very poor sightlines for those living in Sydenham.

The other element is that a high private wall (the corner of station approach and high street with the empty outlines for signwriting) facing traffic coming over the bridge into the high street has been given permission to a local business who are hoping to do a similar piece or work but as a gateway “welcome to Sydenham” type of piece. Again, taking this into account, it was thought that all being well two signs facing opposite directions/aimed at different types of demographic would cover a lot of bases and work well.

Finally, the other sites currently given permission will hope to be used for non-commissioned work for artists to show off their work whilst keeping in touch with the environment. These are the bridge itself, the run off from the bridge and other walls at the station entrances.

Although no questions were asked, hope that answers a few things Nick as I can’t imagine you fancied trawling through tons of messages (Chris - I promise to make a new thread when something else comes up!).

Kind regards,


Sydenham Mural - Site Location and Condition Assessment

I hear you John but firstly the chap from TFL or wherever needs to be more a bit more specific. It’s s large area and detail really counts rolling this through. Smart Design can work around these things.

For example once done a small team armed with rollers and a clear coat of sealer can add longevity to the piece.

Regarding the long reach of the Sydenham community, a vast majority of residents do arrive in Sydenham by public and other transport. So my point was its position serves the commuter part of the local community rather more than the wider majority. It’s pretty tricky finding anything much better than this though as a prospect apart from that flank wall which is a bit secondary. I agree it’s is a really good location but it could take a fair bit longer to execute, so local helping hands will serve the cause well.

Back to the design slab.


Love, love, love that design.


Hi all - new to this.
But don’t know if this contact would/could be at all helpful?
They were involved in putting together a programme around all the street art that went up in Brockley/Crofton Park - could be really good for advice and seeking legal info in regards to public liability etc



Oh I also really love the idea of a Great North Wood montage, that’s such an excellent idea.


Here’s some amazing inspiration !


Am I mistaken - is that a starling ?

Links strongly to the flocks that centre on the Bell Green retail park.

Birds that in a few generations have shed all fear of humans and curiously have developed all sorts of new food seeking opportunities. It is noticeable how quickly they learn to focus and start pecking on the dirt embedded on tyres and wheel arches on every car that comes into the car park in search of food - can it be seeds or other food ?.


I think it is a starling. But it’s actually a video … if you click the triangle in the middle there’s 9 more amazing building designs.


Can I ask/remind any submitters to post any designs strictly and solely to the email site - Thanks :slight_smile:


I don’t think this will be the case, but as I didn’t outrightly state, to clarify - 1 submission per artist. Please also check the spec to ensure all required details are included. (Ps: this isn’t a response to anything, just trying to reduce any potential issues that may crop up during the process!). Thanks all :grin:

Mural shortlisting meeting - 22nd March 2018
Synopsis of March 2018 mural meeting and plans

Quick question:

Does anyone know any large scale walls near any of the other Sydenham Stations that would be owned by NR? I use to use Sydenham Hill a fair bit and have been down to Bell Green for various things. Only thing that springs to mind is the bridge to the right of Sainsbury’s and the left of lower Syd station. Do shout if anywhere else you can think of. Don’t think we have an abundance of large surfaces unlike some other nearby places but hey ho. Just a quick question!



The bridge you describe is the Southend Lane Bridge and is indeed owned by NR.

You may recall it being discussed at our first meeting and not being greeted particularly warmly as a candidate location.

All sorts of arguments - whilst a good “gateway” site, too far away, not really in Sydenham etc.

But all-in-all perhaps worthy of reconsideration.


Not for reconsideration for this project John however just looking into possibly suggesting it for Lionel’s traditional workpieces which have been signed off for some funding by NR to be placed around. I’ve spoken to NR on the phone and emailed Lionel and it is seperate to this project and they are looking for very large scale impact pieces which will be that particular old school design. Due to the timing of this funding only becoming available this week (after the spec had gone out and people had worked on and submitted designs) and funding being for that specific design it’s not something we can access or try to shift into the project secondary to Lionel submitting a different style of sign (at least in part due to the surface of the wall) as well as other factors.

I will talk about this briefly at the meeting!

Thanks for the feedback John, just wondering if there were any other potential large walls in parts of Sydenham owned by NR we could suggest for their specific project as I don’t know every nook and cranny of SE26 lol.


Understood. And on the timing issue too.

Great news on the funding proposal - look forward to tonight’s update.


Excellent meeting tonight.

Especially the roll-out of prospective designs and feedback from the local assembly and Sydenham Radio spot.

Some superb designs and a big thank you to those who made the sterling effort to make submissions.

Look forward to next meeting.


@JMLF - could you post the designs that have been submitted?

I’m sure a lot of us would be interested to see them.



I am reminded that an opportunistic piece of information emerged from Thursday night’s meeting for Sydenham’s Mural.

The ever ubiquitous Ed (for he also acts as the NR link for the Sydenham project) advised you that NR has announced details of a funding pool of £10k for additional murals. I believe NR plan to get 4 or 5 murals out of this funding.

One of the constraints being that the walls to be selected must belong to NR.

It is my recall that the meeting agreed that SydSoc should be updated - @pattrembath, @annabel_mclaren - please note.

Apologies if this duplicates communications already made.


Busy weekend!

@jgdoherty JGD - I actually put the Sydenham society / Annabel in contact with Eddie/NR before the meeting last Tuesday but have just emailed her to clarify and give further info re: the funding and the project they are doing.

@chrisbeach will be putting them up with an update tomorrow. Am sending them off to the NR and Conservation guys to ensure all are fitting for them before going to the vote!

The Mural Designs!

@JMLF - as I said apologies if this duplicated communications.

Good to hear SydSoc is aware.

Separately - let us hope the Property World gable end might be viewed sympathetically by NR.


No not at all! Always good to be reminded of things and double-checking!

As always many thanks for all your contributions